Lol Israel!!

Actully Fling, they are right where they belong.

The Israilis are Jew's. They have been there since the dawn of time. Ever since Mosses led them out of Egypt. The Palistinians and the Jews have been fighting over that same piece of land forever.

The Jews have always been there, it just wasn't an "Official" country until after WWII.

 

Dane is correct. The Palestinians are "squatters". The one reason that I feel the Palestinians bear a greater responsibility in this situation is the fact that they are the same entity as the PLO.

Yasser Arafat is the leader of the PLO. The PLO is a recognized terrorist organization. Yasser Arafat is a terrorist.

Sometimes the line between war and terrorism is thin. But I can say this with all confidence, based on history, that if it was a war, it would have been over already. Ask the Syrians, the Egyptians and the Jordanians what happens when you declare war on Israel.

Israel is not at war. If they were, there would be a lot of dead Palestinians and a new parking lot for Israeli businesses.

Mani

 

Ok since I am Jewish an damm proud of it an my history Ill lay the fact out for you wannabe now it all's

Nationhood and Jerusalem


Israel became a nation in 1312 B.C.E., two thousand years before the rise of Islam. Arab refugees in Israel began identifying themselves as part of a Palestinian people in 1967, two decades after the establishment of the modern State of Israel.

Since the Jewish conquest in 1272 B.C.E. the Jews have had dominion over the land for one thousand years with a continuous presence in the land for the past 3,300 years. The only Arab dominion since the conquest in 635 C.E. lasted no more than 22 years.

For over 3,300 years, Jerusalem has been the Jewish capital Jerusalem has never been the capital of any Arab or Muslim entity. Even when the Jordanians occupied Jerusalem, they never sought to make it their capital, and Arab leaders did not come to visit.

Jerusalem is mentioned over 700 times in Tanach, the Jewish Holy Scriptures.Jerusalem is not mentioned once in the Koran.

King David founded the city of Jerusalem.Mohammed never came to Jerusalem.

Jews pray facing Jerusalem.Muslims pray with their backs toward Jerusalem.




Arab and Jewish Refugees

In 1948 the Arab refugees were encouraged to leave Israel by Arab leaders promising to purge the land of Jews. Sixty-eight percent left without ever seeing an Israeli soldier. The Jewish refugees were forced to flee from Arab lands due to Arab brutality, persecution and pogroms.

The number of Arab refugees who left Israel in 1948 is estimated tobe around 630,000. The number of Jewish refugees from Arab lands isestimated to be the same.

Arab refugees were intentionally not absorbed or integrated into the Arab lands to which they fled, despite the vast Arab territory. Out of the 100,000,000 refugees since World War II, theirs is the only refugee group in the world that has never been absorbed or integrated into their own peoples' lands. Jewish refugees were completely absorbed into Israel, a country no larger than the state of New Jersey.


The Arab - Israeli Conflict


The Arabs are represented by eight separate nations, not including the Palestinians.There is only one Jewish nation.

The Arab nations initiated all five wars and lost.Israel defended itself each time and won.

The P.L.O.'s Charter still calls for the destruction of the State of Israel.Israel has given the Palestinians most of the West Bank land, autonomy under the Palestinian Authority, and has supplied them with weapons.

Under Jordanian rule, Jewish holy sites were desecrated and the Jews were denied access to places of worship. Under Israeli rule, all Muslim and Christian sites have been preserved and made accessible to people of all faiths.


The U.N. Record on Israel and the Arabs



Of the 175 Security Council resolutions passed before 1990, 97 were directed against Israel.

Of the 690 General Assembly resolutions voted on before 1990, 429 were directed against Israel.

The U.N was silent while 58 Jerusalem Synagogues were destroyed by the Jordanians.

The U.N. was silent while the Jordanians systematically desecrated the ancient Jewish cemetery on the Mount of Olives.

The U.N. was silent while the Jordanians enforced an apartheid-like policy of preventing Jews from visiting the Temple Mount and the Western Wall.

Get your Facts Straight b4 you pass judgement on my people!

KO

 

and the KO sayth..............

"Let my people go."

 

KO = win

I am with you on that KO. I am a big fan of the Children of Israel. I am not Jewish, myself, but I do feel a kindred spirit with them.

Mani

 

Most but not all Palastinians that are in that part of the world of Murdering fucking Psychopaths that value life at the very least.

There are good and bad sadly we see only the evil in that culture!

 

I don't mind the Jews.

I don't mind the Christians.

I don't even mind the Islamic people.

They all worship the same God, they just dissagree on when God stoped talking to people. They all have there hardliners and they are all crazy in there own way.

The sad part is they all can't agree to disagree.

The way I see it, God hooked up with Moses, and they got a lot of people to listen to what God had to say. A lot, but not all the people.

So God sent Jesus down to talk to a few more people. A lot more listened, and found God. Some of course were happy with what Moses had said and didn't beleave in Jesus, but that's cool, becuase they still had God so God didn't really mind.

Then later God hooked up with Mohammad. Mohammad went and helped a lot more people find God.

This whole time, God has just been sending diffrent people around to spread his word. In all 3 religions it's the same God. they just fight over which prophet was right. I think they all were, and it just takes a slightly diffrent spin on the same basic rules to get people to find god.

Kinda like owning a Mustang. If KO has a 68, and Mani has an 85, and I have a 2001 who's is better? What year did they make the best one? The bottom line is, they are all still Mustangs and there is no reason for the 3 of us to kill each other over what year they came out.

Just wait. In 500 years, their will be another religion that picks up where Mohhamad left off, and it will be the same God, trying to help more people find him. He'll just be using someone new to spread his word. Hell for all you know, it could be me.

 

Well I'm glad that at least one person in this discussion bothered to learn something before they posted.....even if you information has a slant.

That is the great thing about statistics, you can make them say what you want.

And Muslims don't pray with their backs to Jerusalem KO, they pray facing Mecca, it has nothing to do with the location of Jerusalem.

I too felt some sympathy for the palestininas and was a big supporter of their cause, until 9/11. I have lost all sympathy for people who use terrorism in their campains. But that does not mean that I think we should kill all palestinians.

Do you know that Gaza is one of if not the most densly populated area on the planet? No a nice place to live, there are about 3000 people for every square kilometer of land, you do the math.

The debate over who the land belongs to is rather irrelivant in my view, who can actually own land? They have been fighting over it for the better part of 2500 years and look where its gotten them. You cannot take the fact away that it is a holy sight to both religions.

On the religious note, (KO will have to provide me with the statistics) it is my understanding that the majority of Jews in Isreal are (I can't remember the correct word to use so I'll say it crudly) non religious Jews, i.e. they are Jewish by birth, heritage, and culture, but not religion.

Now there is no good solution besides peace which often seems like a pipe dream. But this ignorant lets kill them all attitude just makes people look stupid an naive. Just like after 9/11 when people were sprouting lets kill all Afgan or lets kill all muslims.

If you are actually interested in what is going on over there, like KO, do yourself a favor and learn something about it.

If you are at all interested I recommend a short, excellent book. You can probably easily read it in a weekend and it offers a different perspective.

It is called Blood Brothers by Fr. Illias Shakur (sp? on his name). He is a CHRISTIAN, ISREALI, PALESTINIAN, who is living in Isreal running an colllege for student of all faiths and cultures. He was living in palistine when the Isreali state was established.

Very good book, very interesting man.

So, do yourself a favor and learn something before you start preaching about Genocide, we had enough of that stupid shit throughout history, and unfortunatly it still happens today. So stop thinking of the world as it relates to your small, cushy, middle class, suberban, United States living and take a look at what other people deal with every day. I'm sure they are not thinking, "How am I going to make T2 practice tonight" after their house had just been bulldozed, or after your daughter has just been blown up by some coward on a bus.

 

Actully, that's exactly what I'd be thinking if my house just got bulldozed. "How the f**k will I make it to practice tonight?"

 

Dane,

I think that is one of the most insightful stories I have ever read. It is truly inspired.

Thank you.

Don't forget about Hindus though, they figure this all out about 3500 years ago. People who don't know anything about Hindus thing that it is a polythiestic religion, but it isn't. They believe that everybody needs to find their own way to relate to the Divine. They believe in 1-3-33-33333 Gods. That is, however you choose to represend the Divine is fine by them, there are an infinite ways. When they asked Ghandi if he believed Jesus Christ was an incarnation of God, he said, yes, but not the only one. Hindus believe in a number of incarnaton of God, inface Vishnu, who is one of the 3 Gods, is the God that incarnates. But their hole philosophy is centered around finding God within yourself, the image you use to do that is up to you.

Its funny, until recently they had no way to make a person a Hindu. No way to "convert" people because they have never tried to convert people, if you are Hindu, you say you are Hindu. Its a facinating religion and the Third larges in the world, also the oldest.

But again, thanks dane, that was a truly inspired story and it is very very close to what I believe. Though I never really thought of it in that exact way

Rayz

 

I take back all the nice things I just said about you

 

I never said that it would be easy or even possible, I simply said that destroying one side was not the right way to do things.

Did you know that there are some groups whose goal it is to get all the Jews into Isreal, b/c they believe that once all the Jews in the world are back in the Holy Land, the end of the world will come? They do anything they can to get Jews to move their. Some people are just fucked up.

I'm not saying that you musn't deal with terrorists or punish them or anything like that. I'm saying try to understand a people before you categorize them by their extreemists.

 

You mean ones that dont goto Synagogue? It would be my view that people living there that Die there are purely there becuase of religious reasons, and for that matter every a Jew has died in a senceless Suicide bombing has made a trip to the temple for the morning of there loss. I Bet Candles are in hard demand due to all the morning that the Jew's do.

Just explane to me when have the Jews ever gone and instagated anything over there with weapons?

If my memory serves me correct the Jews and Palestinians current conflict was started all because some stupid picture of a Jewish politician was taken infront of a Mosque. Talk about extream, these people are fanatics.