Theres no appropriate title

I was wondering how I have distorted the Scriptures.

 

Well I am thankful that you have finally started to ask the right questions of yourself.

 

You are doing it again. You continually ask questions or insinuate things about my attitude and thought process. You continually do not answer the questions I ask of you and you fully expect me to answer yours.

 

Annoying isn't it?

Read that post of yours again, then go back through this thread and read how you respond to people a lot of the time.

I think we have had a break through.

 

You put your own spin on what you interpreted from reading the bible and extoll that as The One True Way, then go on to tell other people that their interpretation is wrong. At its smallest unit, religion is about an individual's relationship to whatever being they want. How they worship, who they worship, and what they hold sacred is their own prerogative, and they do not need to answer to you or anyone else how they go about their own spirituality.

You look like a fool preaching the openness, forgiveness and acceptance that christ is written in the bible as demonstrating, and then turning about and telling someone that their interpretation of religion, christianity and whatever else is wrong. You can word it as delicately as you like, but it all boils down to "I'm right, you're not."

 

I believe I have answered every question that was asked of me except for Ohm's (which I am working on) and Test's-(I think Mani answered that one for her). If you read early on in the post-I have apologized for not using correct typing behavior in the beginnning. Kinda new to posting on the net and I didn't know that caps was interpreted as yelling. Believe me, I have said not one thing in this entire post out of hatred, nor arroagance.. I do apologize if has seemed that way.

Would you please answer post #461

Thanks,
Zab

 

There.

 

I don't think that question was for you Springwheat

 

Thats ok, I volunteered to give my own interpretation.

 

& another thing Mr. wheat-people asked me to back up my thoughts. That I have done with Scripture that I believe is true. That is all I have done. I have not twisted nor contorted it in any way what so ever. People asked questions & I have given the best answers I can. If you think I have twisted Scripture by some how fitting my own view-please feel free to show it to me. I do need to know if there is something that I have said that is incorrect to Scripture.

 

It's not so much that you are twisting the scripture, as they can be interpreted (at least that's what I think) in many ways, but it's that you're referencing and proving yourself through scripture that is inherently twisted because it's written and put together by men.

 

That is exactly the point. Your fundamentalist view of the bible and christianity has alienated several people in this thread. Your approach has failed to convince any doubters through logic, and when confronted with a valid counterpoint, you fall back on asking posters in a thread based on personal opinion and interpretation explicitly where you were wrong.

Which part do you not understand?

 

I agree with you 100%. I think the essence of spirituality is it's meaning to the individual.

In terms of any belief (outside of tolerance for other beliefs) I don't believe I have said anyone's interpretation is wrong. Recent posts have been to make a point, and I even spelled that out. The only questioning of beliefs I have ever tired to make, was to open the door to the possiblity of more than one "right" answer. As you mentioned already, the only truly right answer is the one that holds meaning for you.

Where I will say someone's beliefs are wrong is when their beliefs refuse to be tolerant or accepting of other's beliefs. Intolerant of intolerance? A circular argument that has no meaning? Maybe if you just read the words, but in practice it works out just fine.

It's like freedom. You have the freedom to do many things, but you do not have the freedom to take away my freedom So freedom restrains freedom. Similar principal.

You may answer posts or a direct question when asked of you, but you seem to miss the point of most posts and fail to address there core. So I returned the favor. Quite childish of me, but I never claimed to be a saint or mature.

Here is the difference between you and I. I don't believe your faith in Christ or the Bible or Christianity is misplaced or wrong. It has obviously helped you to overcome obstacles in your life and make your life and the lives of those around you better. I believe that is the essence and gift of faith and spirituality.

However, I also believe that you can damange and hurt those around you by not respecting their beliefs and by the fact that you feel that your way is the only way to have a meaningful and healthy spirituality. I believe that that goes directly against the essense of faith and spirituality.

Mani talked about absolute truth. I believe that there is a truth out there, just that there are infinate paths to that truth. And your personal faith and spirituality is how you get there.

So our fundamental difference is not actually any of the facts, figures, or prophecies regarding Christianity. I think that you are "right". I just do not think that it is the only "right" answer. I know that you cannot resolve that in your beliefs, but I can and that is where we differ.

In the end, I will leave it up to one that is far greater and far better than I to explain. I emailed her my earlier post.

The End

 

That reply was directed at Zabdiel. I should have been more clear.

 

I thought it might have been, but I actually found it applicable

 

Only to the Christians in here

Thanks for saying all that Rayzer =)

Some people have come into the discussion and have not understood what has been going on in here. There have been athiests and agnostics just trying to stir and muddy up the waters in here. My whole point in here has really been to get people to think, (why do I believe what I believe). If a Christian has a religious backed belief that they rely on, does it match up with what scripture says about that subject. When we (Christians only) start having emotions and feelings about who God is, or His teachings, it must match up with scripture or our thought process is incorrect. (If Scripture is God's Word and we know God can not error-then we are the one's in the wrong). Somehow we have not understood the scripture correctly or we are twisting it to make ourselves more comfortable. I am a student of the Bible daily, studying it in Greek and Hebrew at times, to understand what God desires of me & us, so that I can use that to teach others. I understand (from a Christian perspective) the responsibility that God places on teachers of the Word and that is why I am so adimate (however you spell it) about what we tell others to be correct.
A young believer who does not understand the things of God does not upset me. It is the false teachers who steer those with a open heart and a listening ear in the wrong direction (scripturaly speaking here). I see many people in the church, just accept what is being told to them as solid rock, when it isn't. We as Christians really should read and understand scripture so that we are not leading others in a way which we think is right but is not correct when compared to God's Word.

While this entire post has been going on, I have been watching how Christians will attack other Christians in here. (& I'm not talking about trying to correct doctrine). We should all (Christians) take a look back over the thread and maybe see where we should have handled things differently. (Me included at the top of that list)

Please accept my apology if you think I have been trying to convert anyone. (I know I can't do that). =)

 

Zabdiel, how can you not bring emotions and feelings into who God is? That is what makes God meaningful to you. It would be fine if the Bible was written by God, but we know it is not.

If everything in the Bible was so clear and straight forward, with only one interpretation, you wouldn't need to do this:

Are you somehow more adept than the thousands of scholars that have studied and interpreted the Bible over the last 1500 years? No, you study it to find meaning for you and in your life. You are saying that because you read the bible and study it you are always coming to the correct conclusions? Last time I checked, you were not infalable. So you do your best, but that does not guarentee that you are always correct.

Why do you think there are so many denominations of Christianity? Because there are so many different beliefs on the finer points. So now only one denomination of Christianity can be right?

Catholics believe that during the consecration of the bread and wine, it is transformed into the Body and Blood of Christ, just as it was at the last supper. Protestants believe it is a symbolic representation of the Body and Blood of Christ. A rather fundamental difference in interpretation and traditions, but both consider themselves Christians.

Right for you does not mean right for everyone else. And since humans are all falable, if someone studies the same thing you do, as long, hard, and deeply as you do, using all the same resources, and comes to a different interpretation of the same Bible passage, who is to say which of you is "correct"? A third opinion might be different still.

The silly thing about all of this is I know full well that I'm not going to change your mind, just like I know you won't change mine. I guess in that we are the same, we both seem to enjoy banging our heads against the wall

 

the bible was written by man..is that correct? i mean...other than the ten commandments(a story written by man) i don't believe god ever wrote anything....and man is failable...man makes mistakes...man is influenced by his surroundings...and to be honest...the early christians had alot to be pissed off about...correct? think that might affect some of the writings? just wondering....

now...in college when i was studying religious history...oh god ages ago i hope i can remember this passage...it seems that some christians like to take many of the written words literaly....how would this passage be taken? "solomen(or god...was it saul..ive slept soo much since then) loved david that he put him before his wife/wives/women" something like that...now...we can say...knowing that back in the day men had many wives and valued them above anything...because they produced daughters..and daughters produced alliances and a continuation of the bloodline...women were cattle traded for peace and property...they were items of value...whatever tho thats another topic...so maybe david was worth more than all the lands and alliances that he could get...but if were to take that passage or quote literaly as many things are taken from in the bible...we could say that well...he was queer...*shrug* i dont' care one way or the other...but all im saying...if you believe all the words of the bible literally...there is no way that you can indeed live the way the bible wants you too...times were different back then...we've come along way since then...our attitudes have changed...we have learned as human beings that some things can indeed be explained as something other than a miracle...

 

You're still merely trying to convince everyone that you are right. You have done little more than question the validity of other's beliefs.

I thought man wrote the bible.

Thats super, but why not let them think for themselves instead of pushing them to believe exactly what you believe?

Who are you to tell anyone they are incorrect in their beliefs?

So we are obliged to accept a book as fact, but not the words of someone who has read the book? I suppose this does not apply to any of your earlier posts, as they are based in scripture.

You can call it "trying to correct doctrine" all you want, you are still attacking someone's beliefs and trying to force your own upon them.